By on May 10, 2019

Following an announcement that trade discussions with China had effectively broken down, President Donald Trump increased tariffs on $200 billion in goods from the country on Friday. The White House also issued an ultimatum, saying Beijing had about a month to reach an agreement before the U.S. enacts another 25-percent duty on $325 billion previously unaffected Chinese imports.

White the trade war has been in full swing for most of Trump’s time in office, the White House had indicated that discussions with China were progressing at the start of May. That changed after the People’s Republic returned a modified trade agreement that removed much of the legal language that would have made it binding while reneging on other aspects U.S. negotiators already assumed were settled. President Trump cited the backtracking as the primary reason for imposing a new round of tariffs.

Fortunately, the U.S. International Trade Commission said the tariff hike would only affect $2.3 billion worth of automotive goods — ranking them 10th on the list overall. 

Limited for our purposes to motor-vehicle parts, included things like wheels, bumpers, shocks, door assemblies, radiators, gaskets, and seats. While this will assuredly raise the price of such components, potentially resulting in higher MSRPs, the real threat could come from retaliatory tariffs that focus specifically on American-made cars. China has made it intentionally difficult for U.S. automakers to ship vehicles by boat in the past and there’s little reason to think it will abandon that strategy now.

While China often looks like the bad guy, that’s partially the product of having the home-field advantage. China has disputed the characterization that it has reneged on its trade commitments while trying to show the U.S. as a bit of a bully — a claim that is not helped by U.S. Trade Representative Robert Lighthizer’s aggressive style. Regardless of what we think, it has created distrust on all sides.

“There’s definitely disappointment and frustration [in China]” Zhu Ning, deputy director of the National Institute of Financial Research at Tsinghua University in Beijing, said in a recent interview with . “We thought we were on a good path of making progress and having a deal.”

Officially, things have already turned a corner and the two countries are back to business. But the underlying animosity is palpable. “Talks with China continue in a very congenial manner — there is absolutely no need to rush,” the U.S. president said on Twitter Friday morning, before trade discussions resumed. “In the meantime we will continue to negotiate with China in the hopes that they do not again try to redo deal!”

From Bloomberg:

Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin described Friday’s discussions as constructive as he left the U.S. Trade Representative’s office. Chinese Vice Premier Liu He, the top negotiator who led the talks in Washington, told reporters at his hotel that the talks went “fairly well.”

Yet several people familiar with the discussions said little progress was made during a working dinner on Thursday and in Friday morning talks. Liu didn’t come prepared to offer much more in the way of concessions, one of the people said.

Liu and his delegation were expected to leave Washington on Friday afternoon, according to a person familiar with their planning.

However, U.S. officials seemed unsure whether Liu even had the authority to make formal commitments at this point. Internal debates regarding Chinese law were cited as one of the contributing factors for China’s alterations to the draft agreement. But it’s unclear whether or not those disputes have been resolved as of Friday.

[Image: Vacancylizm/Shutterstock]

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82 Comments on “Trade War Watch: Truce Ends, Tariffs Up, Talks Resume, Trump Tweets...”


  • avatar
    highdesertcat

    The longer the Chinese stall, obfuscate and misdirect under the guise of negotiating, the more goods will be affected, to include all automotive goods in time.

    This action was long overdue.

    Even Chuck Schumer is on Trump’s side.

    Imagine that!

    • 0 avatar
      James Charles

      HDC,
      Heard of a company called Boeing? If you haven’t its the largest company in the USA.

      Then look at the number of people it employs, retirees living off its shares.

      Then look at what country has thousands of airliners on order.

      It might be time to buy EADS/Airbus shares.

      How does placing the USA at a 25% trading disadvantage to the rest of the World good? What about the farmers, who will they sell to? The rest of the World have FTAs with guaranteed markets, how will the USA farmers move produce without the non tariff benefits of these trade blocs?

      How long can the tax payer support agriculture, where will the tax dollars come from as the USA economy winds back?

      With the farmers other nations are picking up the slack left by USA farmers making it more challenging for USA farmers to regain market share.

      A big chunk of the world has placed tariffs on the USA.

      You live in a dream, short term at that.

      • 0 avatar
        FreedMike

        Boeing isn’t the largest company in the United States. Sorry.

        But, yeah, tariffs would be a huge problem for them. In any case, though, I’d say the biggest threat to them isn’t Airbus – it’s China learning to make competitive airliners, which they will inevitably do.

        • 0 avatar
          James Charles

          FreedMike,
          I read Boeing is the largest US company.

          Yes China will become the largest producer od airliners ,……. Airbus is building plants across China.

        • 0 avatar
          highdesertcat

          Freedmike, his point is well taken even if the minutia is off.

          China has stolen so much intellectual property from ALL its trading partners that it should be able to be totally self-sufficient NOW.

          Knock off Gucci anyone? How about a genuine original Rolex Oyster (made in China)? Let’s not forget Nike, and Reebok, and Adidas. How about a Cisco Router? Or a PineApple Tablet with iOS 12.3? Ah, the list stretches out to infinity.

          Which is China’s goal under “China 2025.” Complete and total military and economic world dominance by 2025.

          • 0 avatar
            James Charles

            Um, HDC, knockoffs represent a minute part of the problem. Its not nation building or nation destroying stuff.

            Its not good, but its easy to fix.

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            James Charles, speaking of “Its not nation building or nation destroying stuff”, stay tuned for some breaking news over the next few days.

            Trump put things in motion that could very well lead to nation building AND a whole lot of destroyed stuff.

          • 0 avatar
            James Charles

            HDC,
            Do you really understand what IP is?

            An IP default can be as simple as you IN the USA repairing a pickup as an authorised repairer without using a correct part numbered OEM car jack or consulting the OEM even though you have carried out the repair previously.

            IP has become a joke in many instances. It has become a fee and incoming enhancing conduit in many cases for business.

            We had to store some jet engines and the aft mountnhas an OEM part numbered stand to use. A brick would of sufficed, but the OEM insisted we must use the stand or be in breach of the contract.

            Instead of talking knowledgeable, have some insight and research your opinions.

            Like many on TTAC if you research you arrive at better assessments.

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            James Charles, the individuals and companies who had their Intellectual Property stolen probably don’t share your assessment.

            Nevertheless, changes are here. Tariff the hell out of the foreign-made goods America imports to the same extent as American-made goods are tariffed by America’s trading partners.

            THAT is fair and equitable trade.

          • 0 avatar
            James Charles

            HDC,
            I think you’ll its not as much IP being stolen but use of IP not being paid.

            If you read my comment above and you actually understand what IP is you would not make these ridiculously embarassing errs.

            Global business is losing money through not being paid for IP use, not stealing secrets and using them. The US steals and snoops more than any other nation and the Chinese would use this as a counter argument.

            Wow man. You need a software update to bring you into the 21st Century.

          • 0 avatar
            ect

            HDC,

            “stay tuned for some breaking news over the next few days”

            Prithee, sir, enlighten us on what these developments will be. After all, you were so prescient on how the shutdown was bound to turn out….

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            ect, tune in to newsy tv, chan 283 on Dishnetwork, or newsy.com.

            They got this whole thing about Rudy Giuliani going to the Ukraine and now NOT going to the Ukraine vs the NYT headliner.

            Plus coverage of the DOJ IG digging into what led up to the claims of collusion. Somebody is going to prison. Chelsea Manning just got out of jail for refusing to testify when that Grand Jury expired and has been subpoenaed for the next Grand Jury, probably going back to jail then.

            The military movements of the US Fleet through the Suez Canal and the B52’s arriving in Qatar.

            And a whole lot more.

            I think you would really find that by watching newsy you’ll be informed. Not influenced.

            If you follow Trump’s tweets you’ll be among the first 34 million to know the score first hand.

            (We closed our Facebook, Twitter, and other accounts some time ago but have access through the accounts of family members who post news about our travels and where we’re at. We do Text, and often.)

          • 0 avatar
            Lorenzo

            Dominance by 2025? That’s only six years away! Meanwhile, they’ve been reverse engineering Russian jet engines for decades, and haven’t made them any more durable or reliable than the Russians have.

            They still don’t do innovation well, only copying. That has to be part of the culture, and they have a hundred generations of top-down management, from emperors to party secretaries, that limits individual initiative.

            They invented gunpowder, and one Chinese general experimented with using it to propel a projectile through a tube – a prototype of a cannon. There was no support from higher-up to develop it, and gunpowder wasn’t extensively used in warfare until it reached the West.

            It takes more than technology to build a world power.

          • 0 avatar
            mcs

            @Lorenzo: “They still don’t do innovation well, only copying”

            I’ve seen an amazing amount of innovation from the Chinese. Unfortunately for China, that’s almost always after they’d high-tailed it out of the old country for the land of the free and home of the brave. Apparently, when they are smart enough to invent some really great stuff, they’re also smart enough to head to a free capitalist country to do it.

          • 0 avatar
            FreedMike

            Well, yeah, IP theft’s a huge problem. But we do it too. Using the Boeing example, do you think Boeing’s never bought an Airbus product and torn it down?

            So what do all the countries invested in Airbus do – start a trade war with the U.S.? Great…how do they survive without American companies buying their planes?

            Tariffs and trade wars don’t seem like a good way to address this kind of problem. I’d say international IP courts are…but then again, our president is famously against international courts, isn’t he?

      • 0 avatar
        highdesertcat

        Trump’s problem solving approach may fail. Maybe it will work. Maybe not. No doubt time will tell.

        The majority of Americans were fed up with American exports having tariffs placed on them while America did not place equal tariffs on the goods America imported from our trading partners.

        So it should come as no surprise to anyone that Trump is making good on his promises since he outlined what he would do during his campaign.

        Now that he doing what he said he would do, somehow this is bad. Hey, if it was all that bad people would not have elected him to do what they wanted him to do: negotiate fair and equitable trade agreements.

        • 0 avatar
          Arthur Dailey

          @HDC, you need to qualify that statement. The USA had a number of trading partners who did not place tariffs on American products.

          And the new US/Mexico/Canada trade agreement is really NAFTA with a different name and a few minor ‘promises’/compromises.

          I agree that entering into equal trade agreement with 3rd world nations and dictatorships is not something that benefits a 1st world nation.

          I also agree that the Chinese government does not ‘play by the rules’, and cannot be trusted.

          However the policies implemented by the POTUS have cost American citizens millions of dollars and are having a particularly harsh impact on some farming concerns.

    • 0 avatar
      JimZ

      “Even Chuck Schumer is on Trump’s side.”

      when someone’s right, they’re right, regardless of who they are.

      however, my fear is that we’re trying to play hardball while not having the ball.

    • 0 avatar
      Guitar man

      Tradesmen in China make $30 a _week_.
      There isn’t going to be a renaissance in US manufacturing or anything, they’ll just raise the price or import it from somewhere else.

      At best, this might lead to a little more access to the Chinese market for some US goods, principally agricultural.

      There are countries that are much poorer and have much higher levels of protection than the US and still everything there is made in China.

  • avatar
    cimarron typeR

    Maybe this will slow the flow of Amazon packages populating my porch and others which will decrease overall emissions in suburban KC

  • avatar
    someoldfool

    From wikipedia.org:

    The Tariff Act of 1930 (codified at 19 U.S.C. ch. 4), commonly known as the Smoot–Hawley Tariff or Hawley–Smoot Tariff,[1] was an Act implementing protectionist trade policies sponsored by Senator Reed Smoot and Representative Willis C. Hawley and was signed into law on June 17, 1930. The act raised U.S. tariffs on over 20,000 imported goods.[2]

    The tariffs (this does not include duty-free imports – see Tariff levels below) under the act were the second-highest in the United States in 100 years, exceeded by a small margin by the Tariff of 1828.[3] The Act and following retaliatory tariffs by America’s trading partners were major factors of the reduction of American exports and imports by more than half during the Depression.[4] Although economists disagree by how much, the consensus view among economists and economic historians is that “The passage of the Smoot–Hawley Tariff exacerbated the Great Depression.”[5]

    • 0 avatar
      jjster6

      Let’s not forget that this time the US owes a huge pile of debt to the Chinese. And is relying on the Chinese to finance their deficit which is ballooning due to Trumps tax cuts and spending increases. A lot of people think these tariffs are a good thing. My crystal ball says this is going to be very bad. I hope I’m wrong.

      • 0 avatar
        highdesertcat

        “A lot of people think these tariffs are a good thing.”

        For the first time in a long time we have bi-partisan agreement that these tariffs should be levied on China (and others), in view of America’s trading partners having used and abused America for decades since the end of WWII.

        If you’re an American you should be outraged about how America’s trading partners have taken advantage of that trading relationship and SWINDLED Americans out of their money.

        • 0 avatar
          jjster6

          OK, but what happens when the next Treasury Auction comes around and China doesn’t buy? Interest rates are going to sky rocket. And that is going to be very bad. Creditors tend to have a lot of leverage and Trump isn’t giving them any less on the debt side.

          • 0 avatar
            Art Vandelay

            “Creditors tend to have a lot of leverage and Trump isn’t giving them any less on the debt side.”

            For that to hold water, they would have to be willing to come collect on the debt. Good luck. Honestly, now that the US has a more favorable situation with respect to oil we could start to whittle that deficit down by totally pulling out of the Middle East. I think China would find it way more expensive to defend their own interests there than simply loaning us the money to do it. Blue water Navies and forward deployed armies get quite spendy, especially in that part of the world. Good luck.

        • 0 avatar
          FreedMike

          “Swindled”? Given that we signed up for this on our own, that’s exactly the term I’d use. More like “we ran up the charge card until the day when the big **DENIED** message came up.”

          We have no one to blame for this but ourselves, and I don’t think a new trade agreement is anything but a Band-Aid.

          The answer isn’t to go protectionist – it’s to develop new industries and products that the Chinese can’t. Identify the up and coming products that will be in demand, and put our resources into producing them. Then they can come to *us* for what *we* build and beat them at their own game. You can start with alternative energy and electrified vehicles, two things that China desperately needs.

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            America tried it the other way for many decades, now there is someone in charge who sees America’s place in the world differently, and is doing something about it.

            I like the fact that America is becoming more self-sufficient under Trump and less dependent on the kindness of our trading partners who have abused America for their benefit.

            I’m sure there will be pain as this reciprocal process progresses, but anything has got to be better than the status quo.

            My lifestyle is already affected. I try to stay away from Chinese-made goods unless it is made in Taiwan, ROC.

          • 0 avatar
            FreedMike

            “We-Gotta-Do-Somethingitis” gets people elected, but it rarely fixes a problem. A moderately better trade deal isn’t going to fix the problem.

            And as far as “some pain might be required” is concerned, you’re absolutely right. And if Trump was a real leader, that’s exactly what he’d be saying. Instead, it’s all BS and blather. It’s gonna be great – you’ll see. So it failed – it’s not my fault. Blame someone else. Blah blah f**king blah.

            Real leaders are real with their people about the price to be paid for change, and that – among many other things – is why Trump isn’t a real leader. Change is needed, it’s going to hurt, and Trump ain’t the guy to make that kind of change happen. Sorry.

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            Well, Trump appears to be making good at his word. He is doing what he said he would do, if elected.

            No other US President has dared to tread where Trump is venturing. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

          • 0 avatar
            FreedMike

            …except that nothing’s done yet vis a vis trade with China, except for a bunch of trash-talk tweets.

            Call me when it is done, and show me that whatever happened truly made a difference, show me the numbers, and then we’ll talk.

            Like you say, we’ll see.

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            FreedMike, no guarantees, but Trump has already taken this thang farther than any other US president in MY lifetime.

            IMO, Trump beats the hell out of all US Presidents since Ronald Reagan.

            Reagan was smooth. Reagan had finesse.

            Trump lacks any and all social graces.

            Exactly what America needs today!

          • 0 avatar
            JimZ

            honestly the single biggest thing which needs addressing is the imbalanced requirements. we let Chinese companies set up shop here with hardly any restrictions, but willingly let China impose requirements like the mandatory JVs and technology sharing. We never should have entered into those kinds of agreements in the first place, but enough people saw dollar signs and jumped in thinking they could kick the can down the road.

          • 0 avatar

            Trade imbalance is just one way of looking at the matter. Trump wants to slap higher tariffs on cheap imports from China of stuff Americans are no longer willing to manufacture themselves on one side, and he’s willing to subsidize the export of products that American farmers are still willing to produce on the other side. Ever realized that the people who are in between China’s (sweatshop) laborers and retail (retailers themselves incl.) benefit the most. I’d say that this is quite a deal: having Chinese make stuff cheaply without American tax payers being responsible for them, since those Chinese all live in China. Shall we ask them to come over, and enjoy the benefits and standards Americans are used to?

        • 0 avatar
          Kenn

          Yeah, poor little America, swindled out of its money – while giving huge tax breaks mostly to the wealthy (like the insufferable Trumps) and corporations, and spending/wasting unimaginable amounts of taxpayer money on a bloated military budget, including endless wars, bigger than the next 7 countries combined (while eagerly planning for the next war). ‘An empire overdue to fall.

          • 0 avatar
            Roader

            I got quite a nice tax cut and I’m neither wealthy nor a corporation.

            “An empire overdue to fall.”:

            ‘Reports of my death have been greatly exaggerated.’
            Mark Twain

            I remember equally dire pronouncements of the death of the US back in the 80s, when Japan seemed to be an unstoppable economic power house.

            Until they weren’t.

          • 0 avatar
            JimZ

            “I got quite a nice tax cut and I’m neither wealthy nor a corporation.”

            I didn’t.

          • 0 avatar
            Roader

            My marginal rate dropped 3%. Anyone with a taxable income between $10K and $158K got at least 3% chopped off their marginal rate.

          • 0 avatar
            ect

            Roader,

            “My marginal rate dropped 3%. Anyone with a taxable income between $10K and $158K got at least 3% chopped off their marginal rate.”

            At the same time, the deficit was increased by at least $1.5 trillion over the next 10 years – which is a debt your kids and grandkids are going to have to pay.

            So how do you explain to them that you spent all this money on yourself and they’re going to have to pay it back?

          • 0 avatar
            Roader

            ect: “At the same time, the deficit was increased by at least $1.5 trillion over the next 10 years – which is a debt your kids and grandkids are going to have to pay.”

            Deficits aren’t increasing due to tax cuts. Federal revenues are at record levels:

            https://www.investors.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/EDITtaxes_121918-1024×578.jpg

            It’s a spending problem, not a revenue problem.

        • 0 avatar
          smartascii

          HDC, the fact that a lot of people like the tariffs has no bearing on the outcome. People like saturated fats and liquor, and neither is to their benefit. What “people” like, particularly those that are a product of a failed educational system that hasn’t taught anything approaching serious economics in several generations, is irrelevant. What economists predict has, at the very least, a much greater chance of being proven true, and the majority of them appear to expect a fiasco. Yes, the Chinese are not playing fair. And, yes, Trump is doing something. But if your house has termites and you shoot it with a machine gun, that’s also “doing something.” It’s a stupid and destructive something. And so are these tariffs.

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            smartascii, you’re right, but Trump doesn’t ask them about their opinion either.

            Trump just does it. My guess is he looks at the results of the approaches of the past, and bulldozes ahead with his own approach.

            I find that admirable. Trump is not paralyzed by fear or insecurity. He chooses a different path from past approaches, and debarks on it.

            He may fail, but we already know that the past approaches failed. So, a new approach is better than doing nothing.

  • avatar
    James Charles

    I really don’t see any of the tariffs as constructive for anyone, particularly the USA who will and has the most to lose.

    For the economically challenged here is the likely outcome;
    1. Short term downward trend for exports by China incurring job and income losses.
    2. Price increases across a wide range of goods and services in the USA. With job losses and reduced business activity.
    3. USA export prices will rise due to input costs increasing forcing the USA into a more uncompetitive global trading position.
    4. Reduced USA exports due to import tariffs placed against USA products and services by nations affected by USA imposed tariffs on their products. Again a further decrease in employment and business in the USA.
    5. A reduction in the standard of living in the USA.

    China will feel some pain, but its year on year growth is double the USA, so it will absorb the downturn better. China has much more headroom internally for expansion.

    I see greater short term pain for China and greater long term growth. The USA position will gradually decline as job losses and cost of living increases with little scope for income to maintain the status quo.

    You see the rest rest of the World is becoming more competitive because we aren’t placing tariffs on each other or China. The rest of the world is going to be 25% more competitive than the USA and dealing with China because the Chinese have been smart and not taxed its friends and trading partners.

    The Chinese have won.

    That is 80% of the global economy.

    The Tariff Man has screwed up, big time. He needs to treat others, especially friends and Allies with repect.

    The USA is no longer constructive, its destructive.

    The USA economy is big, but not that big to dictate, hence what some commentators on TTAC applaud regarding Trumps actions with “we are’murica and are invicible” should understand you are celebrating disruption, not progress.

    America needs the World and the World is now bigger than America. My heart goes out to those who will lose out because of Trump.

    • 0 avatar
      highdesertcat

      James Charles, this whole mess started because America’s trading partners were placing high tariffs on the goods they imported from America while America did not place the same tariffs on goods we imported from our trading partners.

      The people who elected Trump agreed with his vision of fair and equitable trade, hence the wheels were set in motion for a complete and total upheaval.

      I admire Trump for what he is doing, on all fronts. During the campaign Trump said what he would do if elected. Now elected, he actually is doing what he said he would do if elected.

      That’s refreshing, a politician and promises made, promises kept.

      Imagine the turmoil Trump would unleash if he is re-elected in 2020, for another 4-years.

      • 0 avatar
        James Charles

        HDC,
        It’s to late to act on China unilaterally for then USA. During the Cold War, yes.

        The USA needs all OECD nations to function as one to take on the Chinese.

        The USA doesn’t have enough power. It did have influence until Trump arrived to rally all Allies and friendly nations to challenge the Chinese.

        The more protracted this trade war becomes the greater new trading alliances will be set, in concrete alienating then USA.

        How is this good?

        • 0 avatar
          highdesertcat

          Too late or not, it is being done today.

          And from Trump’s track record so far, starting with the USMCA agreement, I suspect there will be a lot more upheaval in the global economy.

          And a lot more windfall for America.

          For some, that’s a good thing.

          • 0 avatar
            James Charles

            HDC,
            Less upheaval. Man, the rest of the World is not fncking each other.

            The USA is the only nation fncking with others.

            So, if the USA represents 20% of the World and its fncking others how can the USA win?

            Use some logic! Stop living in the past.

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            We have to live in the here and now. I live in the here and now. I don’t ever want to go back to my days of being poor and scratching out a living, trying to make payroll again.

            Set aside all your logic and experience in such matters because Trump is not going to be compartmentalized according to some prescribed socio-economic regimen.

            He is what he is. People elected him. This is what happens when you elect a do-er.

            Imagine how the world will be changed if Trump gets four more years in office.

            Look at how much the world has changed in just 30 months since his election.

          • 0 avatar
            James Charles

            HDC,
            You are a relic from a previous world (60s and 70s at best) and out of touch. All your previous commentary and opinion supports this.

            Sorry.

          • 0 avatar
            thelaine

            HDC, your years have given you wisdom.

          • 0 avatar
            James Charles

            Thelane,
            Yup, his years has given him wisdom. Its unfortunate he isn’t any longer able to function in the modern world.

            He needs 50 years worth of software updates so he can connect with the world. Maybe then his wisdom will be of value.

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            James Charles, this isn’t about me. Trump makes these decisions without asking my opinion.

            I like what he’s done, what he’s doing, and what he’s gonna do.

            I find it curious that the vast majority of Americans are actually behind Trump on this one.

            But stay tuned, Trump is just getting his second wind, as governing in year 3 and year 4.

          • 0 avatar
            thelaine

            As usual BAFO, you fool no one.

      • 0 avatar
        ect

        HDC, you simply don’t know what you’re talking about. The US has trade deficits because it has huge sures in other financial flows (not the least of which is dividend flows back to US head offices from corporate investments overseas). In other words, other countries owe us money and have to fund those obligations by sending us goods. Yes, that’s oversimplified, but it’s fundamentally true.

        It’s also true that US manufacturing output (in constant dollars) has doubled since NAFTA was signed, while direct manufacturing employment has fallen by 1/3 – which is almost entirely a result of automation, not trade deals. It is also true that we live in an age where skilled jobs are going begging in the US, while unskilled workers are begging for jobs – a mismatch that this Administration won’t even acknowledge, let alone address.

        The Law of Comparative Advantage has been a foundation of modern macroeconomics since at least 1817. And we’ve been proving in the real world since at least 1846 that tariffs kill jobs and reduce prosperity, not the other way around.

        As has been noted above, Smoot-Hawley was all about improving prosperity through higher tariffs. It not only didn’t work, it turned recession into depression.

        So, since 1945, countries have devoted themselves to reducing trade barriers in order to increase prosperity for all. And it’s been successful.

        So now, an economic illiterate comes along, buys onto jingoistic nonsense and various conspiracy theories, and decides that unilateral tariffs are the answer to all our trade “problems”. He doesn’t know what he’s doing, and he lies about everything to boot. This cannot end well, for anybody.

        Has China cheated on international trade and investment? Absolutely! But US tariffs don’t begin to address this issue – it requires coordinated action by all of the G& (including the EU as a body). Which is an effort the US should lead, but won’t – because Trump is not up to the job.

        • 0 avatar
          highdesertcat

          ect, everyone here including you have valid arguments against what Trump has done, is doing and will be doing in the future.

          No one is arguing with the perspectives that each of you bring to the discussion. Everyone is right from their view point. I’m OK with that.

          That said, Trump will do what ever he chooses to do to China, and a majority of Americans like the way he handled the trade issues. I certainly do. Beats the hell out of every US President since Ronald Reagan.

          So if you’re against Trump, you’re in for a lot of upheaval in the next 18 months, and 48 more if Trump gets re-elected.

          This guy is on a roll. Taking on the planet’s second largest economy takes balls.

          And yet it is only the beginning of repositioning America at the top of the New World Order by making America Great Again.

      • 0 avatar
        Whatnext

        Clarify “America’s trading partners”. Two of the biggest, Canada and Mexico, had no tariffs as all three nations were part of the North American Free Trade Agreement. Trump decided to launch a trade war against them anyway. Then Europe, then China. Who will take America’s side now?

      • 0 avatar
        philipwitak

        your ignorant, arrogant, orange lying’-sack-o-sh!t of a president managed to squander more than a billion dollars of his own inherited wealth in ten years. you think he’s gonna do any better than that for the rest of us, messing around with our money, instead of his own?

        get real.

    • 0 avatar
      Crosley

      There’s so much factually wrong in this post James Charles, I don’t even know where to start.

      China is 80% of the global economy? What are you smoking?

      So I guess Trump and Chuck Schumer, the most Senior elected Democrat, are both dead wrong and what China is trying to do, we should roll over and accept it.

      • 0 avatar
        James Charles

        Crosely,
        Sorry, and nice effort on your part.

        No, the world without the US economy is 80%.

      • 0 avatar
        James Charles

        Crosely,
        You also gave one example where you had an issue what I wrote.

        So where are the gaps? And what evidence have you got other than a far right nationalist opinion or proof?

        • 0 avatar
          Crosley

          So an issue that Democrat Chuck Schumer agrees with Donald Trump is “far-right nationalist?”

          This is a tweet from Chuck Schumer on this:

          “Hang tough on China, President @realDonaldTrump. Don’t back down.

          Strength is the only way to win with China.”
          ___________

          Do you have anything besides name-calling and factually incorrect posts?

          • 0 avatar
            James Charles

            Um, WTF Crosely?

            What name have I used. I’m rather perplexed?

            Are you dispersing fake news?

            And I have yet to discuss any issue involving Schumer.

            Hmmmm ….. ??

          • 0 avatar
            thelaine

            Yes, he changes his name, from BAFO to James Charles, because he is trying to run from his previous incorrect posts.

  • avatar
    eggsalad

    I’m waiting for the shelves at Wal-Mart to be empty.

    • 0 avatar
      James Charles

      eggsalad,
      The shelves will not empty, you will pay EU prices to live without the social welfare.

      Taxes will be needed as the tax take drops. More taxes as well.

      Thank you D Trump.

  • avatar
    Crosley

    Glad Trump is finally taking the Chinese on, every other American President has rolled over and let them rob us blind.

    Even Chuck Schumer is behind Trump on this. Let that sink in.

    But right now, we have people so blinded by partisanship that they are actually rooting for the Chinese to screw over their own country. Reminds me of the Americans rooting for the USSR when Reagan was President.

  • avatar
    SoCalMikester

    its going to be interesting, either way. trade wars are fun and easy to win! we shall soon find out. worst case this and dotcom 2.0 will help tank the stock market, then i can double down on my 401k and put some money into my td ameritrade. winning!

  • avatar

    China is preparing for the war with US and its allies. US needs to restructure supply chains out of China towards our allies in the region. We should consider China as an enemy not a friend. And besides US is overdue for recession and China for depression. When China goes into depression all bets are off – they will start the war.

    And yes Australia has to make decision will they be on our side or they will support China in the coming war.

    • 0 avatar
      James Charles

      1. Somehow I don’t think China wants a war.
      2. The US doesn’t want a war.
      3. The US is losing influence globally to the Chinese and will push as hard as possible to try and retain dominance.
      4. The Chinese will stand its ground.
      6. This trade war is not about trade, its about power and influence. It is marketed as trade by invested interests.
      5. Australia? WTF? Please stop reading comic books, or you are trying to be a comedian or a troll.

      • 0 avatar
        28-Cars-Later

        1. Elements of the PLA have already gone on record about their desire for confrontation with the RoC (Taiwan) which would draw the US into a conflict.
        2. The US doesn’t seek direct wars with nuclear powers, however it does engage in proxy conflicts with those powers.
        3. Agreed.
        4. Agreed.
        5. Partial agreement, I argue the President actually believes he can bring jobs back to the US through a trade treaty.
        6. My company has offices in Australia and I converse with these offices on a weekly basis. A heavy part of the populations of Sydney and Melbourne are mainland (Han) Chinese, NOT Australians. Chinese investment in Australia is a significant part of the country’s GDP, in fact the economy of Western Australia is directly linked to that of PRC and other south Asian countries due to mining and mineral export. In the event of major conflict it is conceivable the government of Australia could drop its treaty obligations and remain neutral due to the significant ties it has to PRC.

        • 0 avatar
          James Charles

          28-Cars-Later,
          China is the 9th biggest investor in Australia at around 2% of total investments.

          The US is by far the largest, followed by th UK.

          China is very reliant on Australia for agri products, minerals, services and education.

          Australia can and does punch above its weight with the Chinese and if you weren’t aware the Australian military challenges the Chinese in the South China Sea.

          Also, the US threatens military action against other countries. Look at the current Iranian issue. Nth Korea? Not that I in anyway support these countries.

  • avatar
    JD-Shifty

    Trump is a stable genius. god what a bunch of addled old fools.

  • avatar
    James Charles

    28-Cars-Later, I’ve reposted this comment. I keep encountering “Duplicate Comment”, yet no comment appears.

    China is the 9th biggest investor in Australia at around 2% of total investments.

    The US is by far the largest, followed by th UK.

    China is very reliant on Australia for agri products, minerals, services and education.

    Australia can and does punch above its weight with the Chinese and if you weren’t aware the Australian military challenges the Chinese in the South China Sea.

    Also, the US threatens military action against other countries. Look at the current Iranian issue. Nth Korea? Not that I in anyway support these countries.

  • avatar
    el scotto

    So glad to see this did not devolve into an “Old Fat White Guys Who Miss Steve Bannon” and “Repeated Marsupial Kicks to the Cranium Have No Affect on Intellectual Capacity” discussion.

  • avatar
    JoDa

    It has been deliberate USA trade policy for the last 40 years to push manufacturing out of the USA to less developed countries like China and Mexico in order to spread wealth via global capitalism. China’s 25% import tax was a huge part of that policy…It also had the added benefit of starving the midwest/northeast “deplorables” and make them stop breeding.

    Trump wants China to lower its import taxes in order to win “deplorable” votes. The new NAFTA deal will benefit Mexico at the expense of USA, Canada, and China.

    • 0 avatar
      philipwitak

      “…to spread wealth via global capitalism….”

      absolutely not!

      corporate america sold out the american worker because of greed. why would they opt to continue paying american workers $30 or $40 an hour when they could farm this sort of manufacturing out to the lowest international bidder and keep all the cash-saved for themselves?

  • avatar
    JoDa

    It has been deliberate USA trade policy for the last 40 years to push manufacturing out of the USA to less developed countries like China and Mexico in order to spread wealth via global capitalism. China’s 25% import tax was a huge part of that policy…It also had the added benefit of starving the midwest/northeast “deplorables” and make them stop breeding.

    Trump wants China to lower its import taxes in order to win “deplorable” votes. The new NAFTA deal will benefit Mexico at the expense of USA, Canada, and China. Mexico will win the trade war.

  • avatar
    rohman

    China has been a nation state for a few decades. They have been a civilization for millennia. The Chinese in general support their government and the government guides the economy. Americans distrust their government and the government is controlled by corporations. Civilizations don’t operate on quarterly profit/loss timetables.

  • avatar

    So, your import car will become more expensive, and you already paid more for European cars, a premium. Do you expect Detroit to perform better? Trump just makes it easier for the Big Three to be even more complacent. They will probably sell more, but for many Americans they just don’t bring the type of car foreign automakers do offer. Actually the very same reason why most Europeans and Asians don’t crave for American cars.

  • avatar
    DeadWeight

    THE UNITED STATES & HER ALLIES MUST LAUNCH A 1ST STRIKE ON CHINA, COMPLETELY DESTROYING ITS MILITARY CAPABILITIES AND INFRASTRUCTURE. We, along with those allies, can help China to rebuild itself into a democracy that no longer has, as its main priority, the desire to soon confront the western powers, as well as Japan, Taiwan and South Korea, in an all-out military conflict, in order to become hegemonic and export its truly warped value system on the world.

    My comments above all stand, and I am being proven correct, yet again, in my assessment on a major and significant topic of current times.

    I’m currently getting ready for a work trip out to Las Vegas, but do hope that our military is prepping comprehensive, tactically sound, and complete plans for a devastating 1ST STRIKE on China’s military forces/sites, infrastructure and political leadership.

    The sooner, the better, as we lose ability to achieve complete and total success in this necessary endeavor with each passing day.

    PROC is at least as big a threat, and likely significantly larger, given all historically proper historical economic and military adjustments, to the west and our now-Asian allies, than Nazi Germany was in the 40s.

    THE TIME FOR ACTION HAS ARRIVED.


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